It is one very controversial subject to "abort a child that is unwanted." It is a very different and new controversial subject to "abort a child that is wanted."
Below you will read a social media thread I posted in key liberal groups.....
"In the case of a woman getting pregnant and it's not a case of rape or incest or medical risk, or anything remotely different than two people making love....."
"...... if the male is willing and able to cover all expenses, including time missed from work, and is willing and able to take 100% custody of the child after birth......... should he have the right to stop the abortion of the child?"
The LIBERAL RESPONSE
Most of the liberal response has been discouraging, embarrassing, selfish and at times-violent, childish and almost always one-dimensional.
I don't know where the true liberals are. I don't know what happened to equality or what happened to the American heart, but I know a lot of people who are blinded by hate. That hatred is all they have and it's going to kill them. Instead of seeing this as "an equality issue" they insist on seeing it as "an attack on women's rights and an attempt to force control over women's bodies."
A lot of the response has to do with decades of politicians lying to us and working for corporate agendas. No one knows who to trust and people are closing off their hearts to protect themselves. "Themselves" become the primary motivation to everything and they shut down from walking in other people's shoes. At the same time the entire base of "liberal" is the ability to feel and fight for the rights of all people.
You also have a lot of one-topic liberals or people who don't know what a true liberal is. They might be angry and jealous of the wealthy because they're struggling or they're pro-abortion for whatever reason, or they are all about smoking dope and want it to be legal, or they simply don't like a handful of politicians. Here you have the black person voting for Obama because he's black, or the woman voting for Hillary because she's female. (Someone labeled it "the liberal who's a liberal until they win the lottery.") You have the same thing on the other side and people voting Republican because they're prejudice or because they're rich and they think the poor are lazy. Because most people don't get very deep into politics these thoughts and this basic-ignorance can do a lot of damage.
The main problem with this issue is: we've given mothers complete control and rights over the unborn child while destroying the rights of the father. That's un-American and unconstitutional. The agenda should always be equal rights for all. Finding a way to give all parties involved "equality" is the main issue that should be addressed.
Outside of the actual studies listing the top reasons women abort these are some of the reasons I got on social media: morning sickness, weight gain, risk of medical complications, dislike for doctors and hospitals, not wanting to be stuck with the same guy for life, fear of being labeled "a slut," and loss of freedom.
There were no lists about why she shouldn't abort.
Another alarming and continuous statement in the liberal groups was directed to men: "If you don't like it keep it in your pants," as if men were the only people taking their pants off.
In the case of a child who's actually born - another alarming issue was present: a father's purpose. Outside of paying the bills, no one could define it. Love, guidance, nurturing, protection, role examples, stability and family were never mentioned. These people have completely lost sight of what a father is and there was a very present resentment and hatred to all men as if they get women pregnant to control and torture them. No one knew what the hell a father is.... other than some guy who victimized some woman and got her pregnant. Reading these fragile and hate-filled responses was nothing short of sad.
It was apparent that most responding came from fatherless homes but this reasoning is not justified. Because you grew up without a father does not mean you don't understand the role or importance of the father. In-fact it should mean that you're an expert on this issue and you know better than anyone. But, it doesn't work this way. The conclusion, to save themselves the pain and anguish is: Who needs them?
This is the issue that has to be dealt with before all others. It is this: the lack of courage to accept that they needed their father, which must be addressed.
It took people, not just men, not just Democrats, not just Republicans and not just white people, many years to begin to see the light and speak out. Now it's happening but they're being met with a violent response.
It's normal, it's natural and I'm not sure it's healthy but the end result is always - "change." People resist that and it should be expected.
Attorney Jeffery Leving says this is not a gender war and, although several hate-groups are chiming in trying to get the public to support their extremism stance - they are failing.
This is also not a partisan war and several groups and individual people on both sides of the political aisle have many questions, concerns and mixed feelings.
The issue is volatile because it forces one to address long-neglected issues in both the court system and social realm and because we are dealing with extremely emotional topics of offspring, love, bloodlines, betrayal, the break down of trust and more.
From the liberal standpoint, by far the biggest issue is: women fear losing their rights and becoming nothing but incubators for controlling men. Most of the focus has been on this issue but it's at the cost of ignoring all other issues. In-fact it's a complete close-off to any other thought. When the topic of "a father's rights" even begins to emerge the standard responses range from, "I don't give a f*^%k" to "a full-blown attack on men in a cesspool of hate and verbal violence."
Tens of thousands of posts came in and after about 50 hours of around the clock banter before the moderators decided to stop the discussion.
Some people spent many hours doing nothing but attacking the person who asked the question. This told me that deep down they knew that what they were condoning was immoral and they were over-compensating by putting the focus on me. Why would someone spend hours on defending something they knew was right?
At times they were coming in faster than anyone could read them and if the group wasn't private the thread would've gone viral. This told me there was a massive, untapped demand for the topic and it was time to take it to a higher, more public, level.
The attacks get personal and relentless but the beat goes on and, as difficult as it is, it's irrelevant to the bottom line.
Many people state that when the man can carry the child then he can have a say in the fate of the child. This brings up an interesting scenario. For a moment lets say that's possible. As most people have gathered - abortion would be an even greater epidemic than it is today but the question is: Would women be demanding their rights and would they be relentlessly and personally attacked for asking for those rights and trying to stop her child from being aborted? Would they do everything in their legal power to stop the abortion of their child? How, exactly would they feel when they (women) had absolutely no power and control over the fate of their child?
I think it’s safe to say that women would be demanding their rights.
No one could answer this and although he or she continuously brought up the scenario they would completely blow the question off as silly because it could never happen. This proves their inability to walk in anyone else's shoes. They simply did not have the ability to walk in the shoes of a father who wants to love and care for his child.
I don't even see this as a political debate but many do and even further - they see it as "a war." If that's the way you choose to see it, I guess that's fine - I can't stop that but I can say that I have found the #1 key weapon for Republicans to win this debate/war.
Does that make me a traitor to the Democrat Party? If so - I don't care. I will not stand for any group of people I deem morally wrong.
America makes and passes laws that each and every American must abide or they have broken the law and will lose their American rights.
When we create laws to give one group their American rights and that results in any other group losing their American rights, the law is illegal, un-American and unconstitutional. It will, eventually be overturned and new solutions will be created.
Some universities have come onboard and DePaul's sociology department is discussing live threads from social media.
Deepti Pareenja of Schaumberg, Illinois has the most to say, "Some of it has been fascinating but most of the public's input has been irrelevant and an outdated line of thinking. You can see and feel the emotion involved and occasionally a question will arise that leaves us stopped in our tracks. It's those questions we are most concerned with. The law should be cut and dry. There should always be an answer but this time there isn't."
The Washington Times, American Daily Sun and the BBC are working on new articles. They too are getting constant updates from social media pages and will be using some public quotes. I suspect many other media sources will also begin tackling this issue when they see the incredible traffic and attention it gets.
In 1987 and 2001 the UK dealt with this whole issue and it became a very, very heated public debate that sometimes got violent. Men lost.
In 2002 China put men's rights on equal footing with female rights and men are winning legal cases while coming up with brilliant and creative ways to avoid costly legal cases and abortion-altogether.
Republican legislator Brian Kurcaba of West Virginia has been under fire from liberal and Democrat groups on the internet. He has been severely misquoted, taken out context, lied about and threatened by the campfire of violent liberals.
Kurcaba's main quote: “Obviously rape is awful,” but “What is beautiful is the child that could come from this."
Liberals took this quote and wrote their own headlines to say, "Lawmaker says rape is beautiful," and they are quoting him as saying that. They are actually saying the man is condoning rape and the response has been brutally violent and embarrassing with some condoning the rape of his daughter and wife.
Thirty years ago a liberal saying, "All babies are beautiful," would be a typical thing for a liberal to say. What happened to those people? Where are they? If you doubt that all babies are beautiful I invite you to visit a local adoption center.
Debate.org lays out both sides of the argument and takes responses from both sides in a very unbiased way..
To the question: Should fathers have equal rights as women in abortion? 45% say yes, 55% say no. I'm not sure how they do it, if anything is censored, if abusive comments are deleted or anything about the site but both sides give very valid points and it remains relatively civil.
Steven D Hales offers a downloadable PDF file on the philosophy pages of Bloomsburg University. The study was done way back in 1996 but somehow manages to convey fresh insight into this entire topic.
Hales points out the top reason women choose to abort and guttmacher.org along with many other internet sites highlight the number one issue: finances (cannot afford it). This ranges from interference with professional career, not financially stable, interference with school, lifestyle, etc... Republicans continuously point out these studies yet offer very little help to the struggling mother, in-fact they seem to be hell-bent on removing any available help out there.
Still, in the case of a father proving mental stability, financial stability and willingness to take 100% custody we have a potential solution to 74% of the abortions taking place in America. If we have a potential solution that addresses 74% of the problem shouldn't we at least begin to fathom this idea?
Hales suggests that equal rights with mother and father may never exist but we should at-least strive to make that the goal.
Currently fathers are seen as, and treated as, criminal rapists whose rights compete with those who have no rights at all. Even in the case of marriage the father has no rights and a woman is not even legally obligated to tell the father she is pregnant.
The internet research proves this question and debate is anything but new but I believe it's being rekindled and reborn. The new legislation being introduced to some states proves that belief...
The entire American legal system, politicians and journalists across the country are taking a new look at men's rights and trying to figure out how much stock to put into this whole issue but they can't stop the flood of new legal questions and pressure being created by some of the best lawyers in the country.
The proposals being addressed cover rape and if the baby is the product of domestic violence, incest or rape, no
matter who the abuser is, it is rape and that person has lost all American freedoms and rights by violating the law.
Now lets look at the father who did not commit rape and you will see that he-too has no rights.
LAWS -- BILLS --CONVERSATION--IDEAS
Ohio and Missouri are the first two states to introduce new bills addressing father's rights in abortion cases.
The other states and other groups from both sides of the issue seem to be watching carefully and have introduced the question on social media.
Ohio House Bill 252 requires written consent from the father for the mother to pursue abortion but it's a poorly written piece of legislation that does come across as a threat to women.
Furthermore: in the case of a woman saying she was raped the law would require a police report from the incident. Many women, for many reasons, never report rape yet none of this is addressed and again - the bill comes across as just another church-driven piece of propaganda that shows the victim of rape no sympathy or understanding.
Both sides are very, very wrong and miss the most important idea: Equal rights. We have the left defending women and we have the right defending men. What's worse, and most disheartening is: we have both sides attacking the other gender while both sides destroy the rights of the other gender. We have almost no one addressing equal rights for both parties yet we have an open door to do just that.
Biased parties ruin their own agenda and the real, true liberal American dies in their own cowardly silence.
Emotion.... Writers clicking away on WalMart keyboards attempting to draw emotion for the sake of gaining traffic to amateur blogs so they can make more nickels and dimes....
In the meantime humanity suffers. Your civil wars, your income wars, your gender wars, your race wars, your political wars, all your wars and all your violent hate sickens me.